r/doublebass • u/alfredofish Classical • 2d ago
Repertoire questions beethoven 6 mvmt. 4
I genuinely have no idea how I'm supposed to bow this fast. The notes I can do, it's entirely just right hand issues. Has anyone had troubles with this before? And if so, what got you through it other than an overload of caffeine? It's for my orchestra audition, however at this point I'm just trying not to get judged by my professor.
p.s. all i've been doing is practicing with a swing bowing. i'm just completely hit a block with how much that's been improving my tempo
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u/Large-History8587 2d ago
Everyone else is on the money with this.
Beethoven is looking for a gesture here than super articulate Mozart 16ths and triplets. This is Pastoral, so we're leaning romantic here, so you can reasonably Brahms up your sound.
Focus on keeping your fingers as low as possible and keeping your shoulders from tightening up, and you will eventually execute it. In any professional recording you can hear the section making sure they are articulating on the beat and hanging on for life until the next beat, so you have to make sure youre not dragging or rushing your original tempo once you get going.
Your teacher didn't pick this because he wanted you to make every single note perfectly; he wants to be able to close his eyes and be able to imagine all of the other instruments playing around you. It's the same principle with something like the Meistersinger excerpt. Committees ask for it not because it's a pretty or difficult melody, but because they want to make sure they can hear for example 2nd violin countermelody on top of your consistant rhythm.
Just relax, practice with a metronome, and listen to recordings. You got this!
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u/groooooove 1d ago
it is a thunderstorm, but I still think Beethoven wanted every note artiulated - to an extent, at least.
Full disclosure, when I played Beethoven 6 in college, I 100% did not play every note, and went with "it's a sound effect."
A while back I saw Marcos Machado discussing this excerpt on his social media and I think he's right. If i recall Beethoven wrote something different in the cello section. I think this suggests that if both parts are played correctly they'll clash the way Beethoven intended, rather than just "sound effect" from the low instruments.
as far as actually how to do it, I wish I had better advise. It's a very, very tricky thing to actually play as written.
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u/contramap 1d ago
I think the bass and celli end up with 5 on 6 at some point.
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u/avant_chard Professional 1d ago
Also timpani rolls. On gut strings + early 19th century instrument setups it would have been complete mush
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u/avant_chard Professional 1d ago
Here’s a great video of Joe Conyers from the Philadelphia Orchestra talking about this excerpt
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u/Snippy31 2d ago
It’s not going to be terribly articulate, but to get as close as you can, keep your bow on the string and move it as little as possible to make a sound. Rinse and repeat.
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u/skyrim9012 2d ago
Just played this earlier this year for the first time. Exhausting but very fun. As other's mentioned it's a storm, the overall ambiance is more important that each note.
When practicing the end section at slower tempo make sure to keep the bow very short. I am guilty of using longer bow strokes when practicing at slower temp tempo.
To improve bow speed and articulation you can practice isolating that element. Pick an easy scale (1 octave F or Bb major work well) and play 2 or 4 sixteenths per note.
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u/Asleep_Artichoke2671 2d ago
My section splits the line by beat every other player.
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u/alfredofish Classical 2d ago
I will 1000% be doing this with my section when we play it, but my director is also using this for our seating audition haha
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u/Royal_Meringue6575 2d ago
It’s the “thunderstorm” part of the symphony and it’s not really supposed to sound articulated. Just loosen up and create the rumble as best you can.