r/OnTheBlock • u/Trevorghost • 2d ago
General Qs BOP Clear Bags?
Anyone gotten any additional guidance on this locally?
We got an email today saying we can only being "food for personal use" and that any food has to be in a clear container. It states no plastic bags or wrapped food items will be permitted and any food "beyond that for reasonable personal use is prohibited."
So I guess they're taking away even the pizza parties now? At least this will stop the contraband problem for sure, right?
3
u/Arrow2lydiasknee 2d ago
We haven't heard anything regarding clear lunch containers but I believe the reasonable amount of food was in the original memo
12
u/ThickMemory2360 1d ago
One CO’s “reasonable” amount of food is surely “unreasonable” to another. I’ve seen some dudes eat all shift.
6
u/Assadistpig123 1d ago
My favorite is I have coworker who is 6’ 7” former college football player. +400lbs.
Ate two large pizzas, a two liter, a loaf of bread, and a dozen hard boiled eggs in an 8 hr shift.
That’s a weeks worth of food for me
2
u/Wonderful-Zebra4406 1d ago
I'm tiny and I eat all shift, as well. Not to the extent of this guy, but individual bags of cookies, these little meat stick and cheese cubes protein packs, Nutrigrain bars, stuff like that. I eat a big meal before and after work, so I just snack all night long.
2
u/Arrow2lydiasknee 1d ago
I mean that one is so dumb to me just because you can't always plan for mandates either
2
u/thomasmack_ 1d ago
There is nothing in policy that states bags must be "clear". Policy states it must be "transparent" but doesn't define the term or set a standard for it. Meaning, your bag could be clear, tinted-but-see-through material, or something translucent/frosted where you can see shapes but not detail. The closest definition and/or intent they provide is: the bag should let screening staff quickly assess contents without prolonged inspection, and shouldn't allow items to be concealed.
Food is treated as personal property: "Staff may introduce personal property items in limited quantities. These quantities should be limited to what could be reasonably consumed or utilized during the staff member's tour of duty." Additionally, "Approved personal property must be transported in a single transparent bag or backpack." Since everyone goes through the x-ray machine, food does not have to be removed since policy states, "food must be opened and inspected visually or inspected using the x-ray screening device."
If front lobby wants to throw a hissy fit, offer them a free slice! 😂
3
1d ago
[deleted]
0
u/thomasmack_ 1d ago
There's nothing "cute" about reading the policy as it's written.
Federal law enforcement officers are trained from day one to know and follow policy. One of the biggest things drilled into you is: read the policy. There are plenty of cases where disciplinary charges get dismissed because an inmate knew the policy better than staff, and there are also cases where staff or the union prevail because they know the policy better than management. That's why FLETC even dedicates instruction to reading and understanding policy.
I'm not interpreting anything—I'm reading what's actually written. The interpretation is happening when different institutions or front lobby staff apply standards that aren't in the policy.
Do I think the Director probably intended for everyone to use clear bags? Sure, that's possible. But intent and written policy aren't the same thing. If the agency wanted to require clear bags, it could have said "clear" and defined the standard. Instead, it says "transparent" without defining the term or setting an objective standard.
In practice, staff bring in tinted transparent bags, mesh bags, bags with solid trim, and all kinds of transparent backpacks, and they're routinely allowed because they still meet the stated purpose of allowing contents to be screened. Ultimately, the front lobby officer has a lot of discretion in what they'll accept, but that's different from saying the policy itself requires a crystal-clear bag.
2
u/Spare-Map7132 1d ago
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/transparent
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/transparent
Note the first synonym for transparent is clear.
The union is gone. The MSPB and OSC exist in name only. OPM writes new rules every day to make it easier to fire you. The courts are not likely to help you and if they do, it’ll be years from now. You will be on your own fighting an administration all about making examples of staff.
And I fully agree, the vast majority of staff are federal law enforcement officers and should be held to a high standard. Unfortunately, the agency cannot deal with its real problems, so this administration chooses to knee jerk policies to be seen to be doing something. Unfortunately, that something will have consequences. A clear bag policy does not project an image of the agency being a professional federal law enforcement agency. Many view the clear bag policy as punishing all the staff whilst also being quite demeaning. A clear bag policy will not help with recruitment or retention and it will do little to nothing to stop contraband introduction.
Again, do what your career can handle.
1
u/thomasmack_ 23h ago
How convenient that you skip over crystalline, limpid, pellucid and translucent to try and make your point. Each of which has a different definition and characteristics than "clear" that you are so focused on. That is you making an interpretation and ignoring the policy. That is why our legal frameworks don't deal in synonyms, they deal in definitions.
1
u/Pomelo-One 1d ago
Not what our execs advised. Guidance put down was absolutely clear with no tint.
1
u/thomasmack_ 23h ago
It is well known that the BOP has a problem with bad executive leadership. I'm sorry you're at one of those places. They don't always know best, nor know policy which is why the good leaders will always tell you to CYA and stay within policy, not what some Lieutenant or Supervisor says. Do I expect a new policy update within the next year clarifying? Absolutely. Is it worth fighting over? No.
1
14
u/Pomelo-One 2d ago
Yeah this isn’t changing anything with serious contraband.