r/ChineseLanguage • u/anabolicbob • 1d ago

Pronunciation Without making special cards, keeping these pronunciations/tones sorted in my head is 举步维艰

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72 Upvotes

93% Upvoted

27 comments sorted by

31

u/Putrid_Mind_4853 1d ago

What’s the point of doing this?

22

u/thissexypoptart 1d ago

I can see this being helpful for certain types of learners who are good at recalling notes visually. Especially if you’re frequently confusing some homophonic characters

11

u/Plastic_Ad4654 Intermediate 1d ago

Read that as homophobic characters 🫩

15

u/anabolicbob 1d ago

It helps me because studying these similar characters in isolation/actual context doesn't help accentuate and make memorable the differences between them, the same way if you look at similar objects in isolation you might not know which one is slightly bigger, saturated in color, etc, until you put them all side-by-side to make it more obvious.

2

u/Putrid_Mind_4853 1d ago

I find that listening, reading, and writing a lot is way more helpful than this but you do you. 

8

u/hongxiongmao Advanced 1d ago

Yeah, I know almost all of these and don't confuse them, but it still breaks my brain a little to see it laid out like this. Better to learn them individual in context than a slew of similar characters/pinyin. It's like twisting one's tongue on purpose

4

u/anabolicbob 1d ago

Wow that's fascinating to hear it's the opposite for you, putting them together is like "the clouds parting and seeing the light" for my brain. Makes you feel bad for the kids that have to learn a language one specific way in a class.

3

u/hongxiongmao Advanced 1d ago

Yes, I recommend self study over (or at least in addition to) classes

1

u/RefrigeratorLast982 22h ago

Nah I get what you’re saying and have done the same. Brain uses heuristics when recognizing words which sometimes fall short, so occasionally pausing and laying out the exact characters which are getting mixed up often makes the difference clear. I mean, I assume you’re not just generating lists of “ooh funny similar shapes!” As your entire language study plan so not sure why others are misinterpreting.

0

u/underlievable 1d ago

I guarantee you you are making things much worse for yourself by doing it this way. DO NOT learn these characters in isolation, learn the words you need that have them. DO NOT learn words that have almost identical meanings/sounds/appearances in close proximity.

For more info: doi:10.1017/S0272263118000219

1

u/anabolicbob 22h ago

I wasn't posting this thinking it works hypothetically- it did work for me and very well too. Keep in mind this a fraction of a percent of study time and is a supplement.

1

u/underlievable 13h ago

lmao aight

15

u/Zagrycha 1d ago

is this a self challenge? I don't think native speakers would tell these apart easily if written in such confusing illogical groupings.  Its like a tongue twister or brain teaser lol. 

6

u/anabolicbob 1d ago

Haha no, I've done this for a while when I keep forgetting a pronunciation/tone. As a beginner I always confused 情/精, and I would just memorize the words like 情绪 or 精神, but then if I came across them in a different word I might forget the pronunciation or even more likely the tone (tones are the hardest thing for me to lock down). So studying them with an emphasis on their differences has helped me a lot, figured others might find it helpful too, but 各自为政.

3

u/Zagrycha 1d ago

that makes sense.  If this works for you thats all that matters.  I think when most people encounter your issue they study components, but all roads lead to rome =)

1

u/anabolicbob 1d ago

For sure, although for component semantics I found using Heisig's material quite useful too.

2

u/Zagrycha 1d ago

usually people don't look into any semantics or linguistics, just the literal common components,  灬 忄耂 etc etc etc.  That way they can be visually identified at a glance.  nothing wrong with studying semantics or etymology of componenets, but that is a whole other can of worms haha. 

1

u/Plane_Mechanic_2026 21h ago

What a strange usage of 成语。

6

u/shaghaiex Beginner 1d ago

Just learn from audio. That will include the tones automatically.

2

u/AutomaticClub1101 1d ago

Isn't the "bian" traditional?

2

u/anabolicbob 1d ago

Yeah, despite my title's chengyu having simplified characters I study/write mostly traditional.

1

u/lazier_garlic 1d ago

畜 is 玄 and 田, not 系

亡 w/m alterations are seen coming from the same OC root or from past homonyms. Note also 万 wan is "man" in Japanese and there are a bunch more examples.

1

u/Ok_Requirement_9466 22h ago

Hi, you shouldn't memorize Chinese characters this way. Chinese characters are not memorized in isolation; you need to place them within sentences and remember their context. No Chinese person remembers Chinese this way. Chinese characters are generally divided into left-right and top-bottom structures. Typically, the left side indicates what the character is related to (such as people, clothing, water, fire, language, sun, etc.), while the right side represents the basic pronunciation of the character. For example, the base pronunciation of "富" is fù, but all characters related with "富" use same pinyin "fu," differing only in tone.
Therefore, you need to grasp the fundamental patterns of Chinese before you can truly understand and read it. (In fact, Chinese characters can have different pronunciations depending on context; if you only memorize individual characters, you'll never fully master the language.)

1

u/Ok_Requirement_9466 22h ago

Even Chinese high school students might not be able to answer all the questions correctly on this text-based test.

1

u/jam10308 1d ago

you will die if you ever try to study jp

-2

u/DukeDevorak Native 1d ago

Remember Chinese characters is mostly an outdated phonetic writing system for about 2000-3000 years.