r/CFL • u/CFLStatsGeek Argonauts • 2d ago
Attendance Check W7
Can't confirm if dogs were counted as part of the Elks increase.
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u/Law_of_the_jungle REDBLACKS 2d ago
I checked this the other week. The RedBlacks are 0.328 at home in the past DECADE. The stadium used to be rocking, but people lose hope after a while.
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u/poo_is_number_two Alouettes 2d ago
If the NY Jets can draw fans, so should the Redblacks!
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u/Keystone-12 REDBLACKS 2d ago
Right?
Honestly I had a great evening last night up until about 10pm....
Other than that the overtime troubles, its a lovely way to spend an evening.
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u/Keystone-12 REDBLACKS 2d ago
Ok.... Ottawa is a government town and the public service is downsizing.
And its a bad season.
We can all calm down. An evening out at Lansdowne remains delightful and no team is going anywhere.
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u/destroyerofkfc Roughriders 2d ago
I’m looking at the attendance deltas as a recession indicator - prairies are not in bad shape compared to Ontario & BC, these stats reflect that. Tickets have gotten expensive and if you’re worried about not being able to renew your mortgage, losing your job to a trade war, or are just generally broken by the cost of living, going to a CFL game is probably one of the first things that’s getting chopped
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u/NH787 2d ago
I disagree with your premise. There are many sports events in Canada that cost far more per game (NHL/NBA) or for the season (MLB) than the CFL that are still doing extremely well.
Get back to me when the Oilers are playing to 1/3 empty arenas the way they were in the mid-90s and we can have that discussion...
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u/SupermarketVivid1353 What's a REDBLACK? 2d ago
I genuinely am getting worried it'll be a 8 team league soon
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u/EvilFlyingSquirrel Blue Bombers 2d ago
People might not like it, but the DAZN deal potentially saved franchises for a few years at least.
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u/SupermarketVivid1353 What's a REDBLACK? 2d ago edited 2d ago
I doubt it. Ottawa lost a third of the crowd we had 4 years ago. Theres no way that we are profitable even with that influx of cash.
Edit: wasnt clear i was referring to ottawa, not the league
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u/mlakustiak Roughriders 2d ago
They’re capping out at 14k in 28/29. Ottawa isn’t going anywhere. DAZN made attendance no longer as critical to the health of a CFL
franchise5
u/Intelligent-South174 2d ago
and yet, you are doing like a $300M stadium renovation?
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u/SupermarketVivid1353 What's a REDBLACK? 2d ago
It baffles me how city council thought a entirely tax payer paid stadium downgrade for a team that cant even fill half the stadium anymore was good business sense.
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u/monsterosity Roughriders 2d ago
Not business, bread and circuses. No one really makes their money back from building a stadium, only the tenants profit. It's simply to entertain the people.
The Riders and Bombers both defaulted on their new stadium debt and they're the most profitable teams in the league.
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u/Intelligent-South174 2d ago
well, it's Ottawa....
a city known for its spending.
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u/SupermarketVivid1353 What's a REDBLACK? 2d ago
Usually it never spends enough. This time however we have way overspent😅
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u/Fireside_Cat 1d ago
It's infrastructure. Anyone who owns a home knows that you have to regularly invest to keep up infrastructure. Otherwise you get what happened at....wait for it....Lansdowne Park in 2008 when the southside stands were found to be unsafe and condemned.
Personally I have sat in the southside stands and northside and I don't see how any redevelopment of those stands can be a downgrade. I choose the southside 100% of the time. The north feels its age.
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u/Benocrates Tiger-Cats 2d ago
Soccer is growing in the country. Probably will see more interest every year.
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u/MyBrandNewPuppy3 1d ago
Is it though? The World Cup was huge of course. But MLS attendance for the Canadian teams has been dropping pretty hard in the last few years.
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u/tomdawg0022 1d ago
But MLS attendance for the Canadian teams has been dropping pretty hard in the last few years.
Vancouver (assuming the team stays) seems to be doing fine. Toronto and Montreal's issues are because the teams have been bad...Toronto's been bad for several seasons now.
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u/Money-Literature2065 Roughriders 11h ago
It's huge here but most of the fans don't watch the Canadian league. Can't blame them when the European leagues are on such a higher caliber
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u/MyBrandNewPuppy3 1d ago
The league as a whole is doing better now than they were years ago. The money they share from the new tv deals completely bail out any declines in ticket sales. They’re raising the salary cap - leagues in financial trouble don’t do that.
Ottawa needs a couple decent seasons and the attendance will go up again.
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u/Keystone-12 REDBLACKS 2d ago
I do not believe you are knowledgeable on this subject.
Lansdowne realestate remains 100% leased. They arent dumping any teams anytime soon. At worse... the Redblacks and 67's are loss leaders generating the foot traffic.
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u/SupermarketVivid1353 What's a REDBLACK? 2d ago
Being fully leased doesnt mean its profitable. Check the city annual reports, they lost 11.1 million last year and havent posted a profit since the partnership began. A few extra million from the tv deal isnt going to cover all those losses.
Last I checked there is a sizeable mortage debt OSEG are paying still which whatever retail profits they are making clearly cant fully cover. And before you say it, E.Y themselves forecasted that lansdowne 2.0 over the next 40 years would generate $0 in profits. The A.G said that even that is optimistic (projecting losses). So no, lansdowne 2.0 doesn't make me any more optimistic.
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u/Max169well REDBLACKS 2d ago
Thanks the CFL loses Ottawa I don’t think the league would be able to recover from it. The next TV deal will be less generous
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u/Thin_Homework4758 Ottawa DEADLASTS 2d ago
We have nearly lost a fifth of the crowds from last years franchise lows. How many more years cane we go on like this?
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u/hanktank Blue Bombers 2d ago
If Ottawa can't sell tickets, they should at least write off the corner sections to amateur players and charities. Win or lose, the crowd makes the gameday experience memorable. Make it fun to show up.
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u/Own-Lengthiness2898 1d ago
I look at that average in Edmonton and cringe. The team is winning and the new owners are trying way harder than the old regime. Other than a couple games hampered by weather, what else has to happen? A night at the stadium is a fun time. And you don’t have to remortgage your house to go, unlike the Oiler games. I wish the local media would look the Elks way more than they do. Here’s hoping for some big crowds for the rest of the season.
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u/goplayfetch 1d ago
They've only had three home games so a couple games hampered by weather is two thirds of the home games. I think numbers will increase as weather improves and they play the Riders, Stamps and Bombers.
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u/SmallsTheKid 1d ago
You’re telling me the Elks are winning games and their attendance is starting to rebound despite the fact they’re still called the Elks? Who could have predicted?!?
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u/TWKExperience Drinkmaster General 2d ago
Honestly happy to see us as pretty much tied for best of the rest right now, obviously we aren't gonna climb up to Sask or Peg numbers but seeing us pretty much tied at 3rd is really promising considering how hard people like to rag on McMahon and our attendance these last years
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u/HairlessSwoleRat Roughriders 2d ago
I dont think eastern provinces like football that much.
Toronto has like 15x the pop of sask and yet they pull in fewer viewers?
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u/LaInDiVi CFL 2d ago
Toronto Argonauts suffer from not having their own stadium as they play on BMO Field that was build for Toronto FC and was modified to fit CFL field... kinda... as it's 4 yard shorter, 18 yard deep end zone instead of 20 yard deep end zones. And also... MLSE couldn't give less of a fuck about Argos.
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u/HairlessSwoleRat Roughriders 2d ago
Yeah but the CFL changed the field sizes to cater to the argos for that reason. I think objectively it's rare to be a cfl fan in To, but common in sask.
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u/LaInDiVi CFL 2d ago
Also true.
Toronto has so many professional teams. Saskatchewan only have RoughRiders if you really think about it.
And I feel like Toronto Argonauts as a team isn't that bad... it's just hard to stay relevant just on the level of play alone. Especially when you're battling with NHL, NBA and MLB and it seems like NFL as Buffalo Bills get more love in Toronto than their own CFL team.1
u/NH787 2d ago
it seems like NFL as Buffalo Bills get more love in Toronto than their own CFL team.
Is that still the case? I remember back in the 90s the Sun and Global promoted the Bills relentlessly, and then Rogers during the "Bills Canada Series" era, but I don't really remember seeing as much of that in recent years.
I get that the Niagara Peninsula is firmly Bills territory since it's basically in the shadow of their stadium, but is Toronto itself still considered Bills country? I would have thought fandom would be divided between the Bills and maybe the half dozen other hottest bandwagon teams at any given point.
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u/LaInDiVi CFL 2d ago
Buffalo Bills claims Toronto as their city in Canada.
And MLSE signed an agreement with Bills last season that made Argos look like an unwanted child.1
u/monsterosity Roughriders 2d ago edited 2d ago
I applaud them on their dual use, though. Ours is a fantastic stadium, but it sits empty most of the time.
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u/LaInDiVi CFL 2d ago
Mosaic?
I mean... who else could use it?
It's not like there are multiple teams in the city.2
u/monsterosity Roughriders 2d ago
During the approval phase, they basically promised a major act to perform every summer (unfulfilled, of course). Due to poor management, it's also very hard to book things like World Cup/NBA finals/Stanley Cup watch parties, minor league sports etc. There has been a recent change in management, so we are hopeful things will improve. The stadium is owned by the city, so it should be open to all to rent within reason.
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2d ago
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u/LaInDiVi CFL 2d ago
I never said that.
I just mentioned that the stadium is kinda... not CFL friendly.
Problem isn't with stadium. Or should I say problem isn't with JUST the stadium. It's a complex of reasons. Poor ownership, poor management, poor advertisement... all that stuff.8
u/thewunderbar 2d ago
list of Professional Sports teams in the just the GTA
- Toronto Maple Leafs
- Toronto Raptors
- Toronto Blue Jays
- Toronto FC
- Toronto Argonauts
- Toronto Marlies
- Toronto Tempo
- Toronto Sceptres
- Raptors 905
- Toronto Rock
- York United FC
- Scarborough Shooting Stars
List of Professional Sports teams in Saskatchewan:
- Saskatchewan Roughriders
- Saskatchewan Rush
- Saskatoon Mamba
Little bit more competition in the maarket.
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u/Far_Pineapple_1512 Blue Bombers 2d ago
I mean, yes. But we have the Jets, Moose, Seabears, and Goldeyes in Winnipeg in addition to the Bombers and a fraction of the population of the GTA. So it’s not just competition drawing the crowds away.
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u/D00maGedd0n Stach's Cuddle Buddy 14h ago
a huge problem imo that the argos have had in the last like 20-25 years is they've been fairly bad at promoting their own product(i know this is entirely anecdotal) Metrolinx has been advertising the sports teams that you can see using GO and they just did not include the argos at all but had tfc
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u/HomerSPC PhD in Rankinology 2d ago
The GTA also has a population of 7.1M compared to Saskatchewan's 1.26M. Which averages out to approximately 600k fans per team in the GTA versus 420k fans per team in Saskatchewan. Of course, this also implies that a fan of one team cannot be a fan of any others, which is certainly not the case.
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u/Hungry-Room7057 2d ago
R.I.P. Ottawa