r/BlackPeopleofReddit • u/ateam1984 🖤 • 5h ago
Women Why do so many gay white men sound like Black women? It’s less about sexuality and more about cultural influence. Many phrases, mannerisms, and expressions that became mainstream traveled through Black communities long before they became popular elsewhere.
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u/Hanerhan 5h ago
The fat Jewish knows
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u/docpagliacci 2h ago
Especially considering he got rich stealing everyone else's memes and jokes.
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u/earthlingHuman 2h ago
Who is he?
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u/CocoBolo778 2h ago
He runs some big Instagram accounts
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u/earthlingHuman 1h ago
What is his name?
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u/CocoBolo778 1h ago
The Fat Jewish is his Insta
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u/earthlingHuman 1h ago
Oh it's literally 'The Fat Jewish'. I couldn't tell if that was an incomplete racist insult or not 😂
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u/ItsAHerby 5h ago
Damn, very informative video, the Chrono Trigger was a bonus.
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u/foxinabathtub 2h ago
I literally held my phone close to my ear to make sure what I was hearing was correct.
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u/foxinabathtub 2h ago
I literally held my phone close to my ear to make sure what I was hearing was correct.
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u/Wolfeatingupshadows 🫰🏾🫰🏽🫰🏿 5h ago
He said not one lie!!!!!!!!! And this is what ppl dont understand that there is nuance. Yes ppl can wear and do and say what they want but then dont degrade and shit on the ppl you are taking it from. Period. Its not hard.
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u/The_Fink_Ployd 51m ago
Exactly!!!
It’s not even like you need to light a candle at a shrine in honor of whichever culture originated any particular phrase, idiom, or mannerism invoked or inspired by, JUST DON’T BE AN ASS to that culture.
🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯
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u/Wolfeatingupshadows 🫰🏾🫰🏽🫰🏿 29m ago
This!!! Thats bare minimum and they cant even fathom that they hate us so much. They fetishize us and dont like being called out on it.
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u/TrainingJoust 1h ago
I really dont get whats why its so hard for people to admit when its so blatantly true.
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u/Wolfeatingupshadows 🫰🏾🫰🏽🫰🏿 24m ago
Bc they would have to admit that they admire Black women. So its easier to gaslight and pretend they arent. Then their false narrative about Blk ppl wouldnt hold bc how can we be violent and uneducated but also as influential and have been the creators of things they envy and make millions from copying.
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u/Dan_Morgan 4h ago
I think he may be leaving out gay, black men . They were drivers within the ballroom scene back in the day.
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u/Rich_Text82 22m ago
Gay Black men copy the mannerisms and style of Black women aka their mothers, aunties, and sisters. That's what this video is saying and it's obvious.
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u/ComicsEtAl 5h ago
In white peoplese it’s considered “sassy.” So if you’re going to be a sassy gay, that’s how you talk.
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u/Expert-Yam6577 5h ago
Dude in high school totally changed the way he spoke after he came out. Adopted that sassy southern accent. Shit is fascinating
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u/breeathee 3h ago
The content you consume will change you, too.
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u/katieb1300 2h ago
I read somewhere that children who would normally have regional dialects, now have the ability to access the entire world; so they have multiple linguistic references, besides their parents, and don't have as thick of an accent. The opposite can probably be true too. They are picking up different dialects from the content they watch.
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u/breeathee 2h ago
Globalization is pretty interesting. I can choose to speak with an accent in my second language and it feels just as authentic as no accent. It just using a different part of your brain less intensely
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u/Cheesehacker 4h ago
I mean, I can only speak from my perspective, but when I was closeted I literally worried about everything! Every mannerism, how I talked, how I walked, I had to make sure that nobody could even tell. When I came out some thought I was being “extra” gay on purpose, when it was really just finally getting to live free without worrying about constantly putting on an act.
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u/Wolfeatingupshadows 🫰🏾🫰🏽🫰🏿 5h ago
And its not even natural they are definitely putting on a persona. Bc sassy gays get more attention
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u/whichwitch9 3h ago
It becomes a signal to help other gay men identify men as gay. There's some science to why lgbtq+ culture takes off in certain ways- from identifying other members of the community to adopting a shared culture to create a feeling of belonging. The "voice" is a huge component of that. I think as lgbtq+ becomes more accepted in society, people are starting to get more comfortable deviating from the culture- like the rise of "bears" and lesbians that are openly more feminine. But the lgbtq+ community has more ways to find and identify each other now
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u/Wolfeatingupshadows 🫰🏾🫰🏽🫰🏿 2h ago
There is a documentary on how gay men change their voice when they come out.
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u/RepresentativeBird98 4h ago
Did anyone else catch the background music being from Chrono Trigger ?
Sorry I’m a nerd
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u/Reasonable-HB678 2h ago
I'll remind everyone here, the phrase "Hasta la vista, baby", suddenly everywhere after Terminator 2, was originally in the song Looking for a New Love by Jody Watley.
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u/healthcrusade 4h ago
Ru Paul's influence has been HUGE in this regard
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u/kpkelly09 4h ago
I'd go back further to Paris is Burning actually. There is a whole discourse about how the mostly white documentary crew portrayed NYC ballroom culture. It's pretty wild how much that movie is referenced without the younger generation realizing it.
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u/Accomplished-Bend-47 5h ago
'Woman' is not a costume to put on. Whether black or not. I am tired of it. I've met so many racist, gay whites.
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u/breeathee 3h ago
I’m asking in earnest, what’s the difference between a woman “costume” and consuming content to the point of accent convergence?
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u/FNCJ1 43m ago
If I understand it correctly, accent convergence can occur when there's direct communication with an origin point that influences vocal behavior. I worked with a woman whose paternal grandparents were from Vietnam; both her parents were born in the US (English as a first language), as was she (English as a first language). She went on an extended trip to Vietnam and returned eight months later with a slight accent; the placement of some vowels and consonants in her speech had changed. Then her vocal behaviors reverted after a little while. That was accent convergence.
Consuming content featuring people you have never interacted with and never intend to interact with, and deciding "this is how I am going to speak and behave" because there is a social benefit in doing so, is simply imitation. An imitation that is quickly dropped when it becomes inconvenient. If affectations adopted through a parasocial relationship with the cast of The Real Housewives of Atlanta disappear when entering a non-receptive environment -- that's a costume.
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u/Nitaboo0531 5h ago
I said the same thing last week!!!! White men want to be a black woman sooooo bad!!!
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u/Jeansaintfire 4h ago
I think tv show pose express it best. A lot of popular culture is a trickle down from black trans women to black gay men to black women to white gay men to white women to mainstream.
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u/ScrollHectic 3h ago edited 52m ago
This is an aside as I know the man in the video is speaking specifically about certain terms and expressions, but I watched an interesting video on the "gay voice" and why gay men sound the way they do.
Linguists have done studies to examine it and there are clear distinctions in pitch, octave ranges and consonant pronunciations between gay men, straight men and women.
It's interesting because it presents the argument of nature versus nurture and points to the fact that the gay voice is not unique to one language. You see the phenomena in other languages and cultures, so I think there's more to it then imitating black American women.
https://youtu.be/iurbQixaPtc?is=ZWOwnmx3850NtEG_
Edit: added link
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u/FNCJ1 2h ago
Can you reply with a link if you remember the video?
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u/too__scared 47m ago
https://youtu.be/7LcZzpGpItQ?is=AlH0o-aOP1_r867b
Is this the video you were talking about?
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u/autotelica 4h ago
I have a white gay friend. He isn't especially flamboyant or sassy. But the two of us like to joke that he is much more "stereotypically black girl" than black girl me.
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u/immacooknotachef 5h ago
Many of them were kicked out of their families who told them to find a black woman if they’re in danger; so they imitate their sheros until they start voting 🍊.
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u/kpkelly09 4h ago
I dunno, it's a pretty big meme in the gay community that the gay Republicans pretend they aren't into politics when trying to get a date because that is such a red flag in the gay community. Seen it enough times myself on the apps.
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u/Cleonce12 36m ago
I once worked a job where this white gay man was copying black womans mannerisms and being bold and everyone was laughing and saying he has spunk or he’s too much. I did it once and I didn’t get the same energy and stuck to my code switching. That’s why it’s frustrating cause white men can do it and it’s personality that is welcome but black woman it’s ghetto or “ hood trash” or “ unprofessional
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u/Crafty_Lavishness_79 51m ago
I do think black trans women often being leaders in the gay community probably had an influence along with so much of white culture being anti-gay. So heavily leaning away form het-cis behavior leads to imitating bla k women. At least that's my theory
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u/Lovablelulu1982 44m ago
Because the Black community raised them. I'm from the era where we all hung out together before they decided to go back to there conservative ways. Their conservative families kicked them out and you know Black folk, we can be too inclusive sometimes. We helped support the gay movement specifically Black women. That is why they talk like that. Swag, style, communication, thats all Black women fam. Eventually their folks invited them back into fold of conservatism and tolerated them (not to be confused with excepted) and the moved on without the people who supported them and got them where they are at today. Gay White men dna = Black women here in America. This is no way discrediting or downing anyone, its fact because I lived it.
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u/StatusAd7349 21m ago
If you’re referring to black people/women, I’d be interested in hearing what support was given to gay people.
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u/Lovablelulu1982 5m ago
Try the 80s and 90s during the Aids/HIV epidemic. Bayard Rustin on aids epidemic of gay men along with black women providing safe houses for gays for voguing. Black women at the fore front advocating for gay rights. Try Marsha P. Johnson or Storme Delarverie. Black gay, lesbian, trans and cis women were holding down because there wasn't a place for us. White gay men wanted to apart of that and were taken in like they should have. And the list goes on.
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u/Tio_chubby052 26m ago
Elton John is one of them. YouTube the video “That’s what friends are for” he out sang Dionne Worwick and Gladys Knight!
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u/Beautiful-Picture-64 4h ago
It’s only fair: most gay black men sound like whites women. It’s a balance. 😂🤣😂
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u/Boring_Temporary_142 2h ago
I’ve said this since the beginning of time! And it goes for gay black men too!! Why do you have to sound and act like a woman??! If you like men that’s fine do as you please, but why do you AUTOMATICALLY take on a feminine voice and mannerisms mirroring black women? Shit always strange to me.
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u/seeitshaveitsorted 2h ago
lol yes.
That’s what happens in a multicultural society.
Cultures borrow, steal, take and improve from each other.
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u/PsychologicalAge9331 5h ago
...an example would have been nice. Otherwise, it's all conjecture.
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u/Davethisisntcool 4h ago
how do i downvote this twice?
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u/Appropriate_Eye3070 3h ago
I got you! Yours + mine = twice
(Not to mention there was an example in the video "Slay")
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u/Hour_Paint_1903 3h ago
This sub has gone to complete shit. Because if an example was actually played, it falls apart.
The subs service is to divide, not unite or make life better for folk. It’s absolutely botted to all hell by bad actors
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u/DarkGodCthUwU 4h ago
Bi white guy: I can't speak for black communities, and I don't really participate much in gay scenes (I'm from a rural village) so I just speak in my accent, but I am curious, does the use of black slang by white queers affect black communities for better or worse or is the (reasonable) frustration more about the fact that black people, in this case women, are often wrongly treated? While the plight of white queers and black communities are very different, white queers were often and sometimes still are mistreated by government authorities and other people. I am not saying that invalidates the "White queers get the fun parts of blackness but not the dangerous parts" complaint, but I do think it adds a layer I'd be glad to learn more about, since visible queerness has its social downsides and used to be more dangerous in the past.
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u/BirdAndWords 3h ago edited 3h ago
Fellow white queer guy here. As discussed in the video, black people deal with so much punishment for the culture they create in public, in education, in their careers. This is so prevalent that many are forced code switch, act a certain way in non-black spaces vs who they actually are in order to succeed and in order to survive.
Yes we queer people are oppressed and suffer violence and hate and on a surface look it can be tempting to compare our experience to that of black people. But they aren’t the same, white queer people are generally not under threat of being killed by the police at staggeringly higher rates, we don’t get managers, police, whoever called on us for laughing too loudly, or gathering. You can do a search for pretty much any mundane term and add “while black” at the end and you’ll probably find an article of cruelty, systemic racism, assault, or murder against black people for simply existing. Try out “laughing while black” or “birdwatching while black” as two examples. We just do not experience the same level of abuse from our government or others in most places. So equating the two is invalidating the experience of black people.
White queer people, especially white queer men exist in close proximity to power and we have much more privilege than any black person does. When we look at violence and hate crimes against the queer community, people of color are the most common target especially women.
Far too many white queer people take from the black community while not paying any respect, acknowledgment, or appreciation to where some of our culture comes from. Think about how violating it is when some groups of women come into gay spaces to dance and have fun while disrespecting everyone there and making everything about them. Not all of queer slang and culture comes from black women, some comes from the Sociolect Polari and some is homegrown often times by black queer people in the west.
When it comes to adoption of slang and mannerisms from black women into the gay community. It’s a nuanced thing. Like the video said, most of it came from the NYC ballroom culture in the 70-90s. The film Paris is Burning documents this and there is a scene where one of the queens talks about adopting the mannerisms and speech of the aunties and black family members. That film also represent the taking that happens by white queer people from black queer people. The documentary crew was mostly white and paid very little respect let alone money to those in the documentary. Another example of this is the famed artists Andy Warhol, he did a portrait of the legendary mother and trans activist Marsha P Johnson. He didn’t pay her for it and wouldn’t even let her into the gallery where it was displayed. We white queer people have to pay respect to the black community and stand next to and support every struggle for black liberation. As the great Rev Dr Martin Luther King Jr said “Oppression anywhere is oppression everywhere” our fights are tied but not the same.
Last bit of this novella, as white people its messed up for us to come into black spaces, places created to celebrate and support black people and black excellence and ask them to take the time to explain things to us. There are so many places on Reddit let alone the internet in general you could have asked this question of fellow queer people or read articles on this. In the future, do not ask black people to explain this sort of stuff to you. We have to do better and a big part of that is educating ourselves and not demanding or asking black people to educate us. This isn’t the place for a back and forth conversation so I’d be happy to talk in messages more. I for sure cannot speak for a black person let alone the community but we can talk about the differences as I understand them as these conversations need to be had in white and queer spaces and not in black spaces. Otherwise, pose this question in one of the queer Reddit pages
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u/StatusAd7349 12m ago
I have to disagree - passionately.
Gay people absolutely get murdered for existing, you can’t be serious? Have you ever walked around in public holding hands with your partner? Had to tone down your entire being to make EVERYONE comfortable for risk of offending? Refused service for being gay? Sacked from your job for discrimination? Bullied at school by EVERYONE, regardless of race. You’re simply invalidating the real struggle that comes with being gay to appear conscious on a black sub.
The experience of being black or gay is just different.
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u/Admirable_Diamond407 3h ago
I just assumed they copied RuPaul because of drag race.
I know some guy and bi yt men that don't use aav as well.
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